Questions about the Freezone movement in NZ

[anonyrat]

Hi, I'm hoping a Freezoner or ex-sci or three will be able to answer my questions.

I've heard that after Hubbard died and Davey Miscavige took over and started squirreling the tech and declaring lots of people SPs, some New Zealand Scientologists split off and formed their own freezone groups. Does anyone know how they were treated by the NZ CoS? I assume they tried to crack down pretty hard on them; was there much fair gaming and harrassment going on? Are there any people who personally experienced this willing to speak out publically or anonymously about that?

I've also heard that CoS members tried to infiltrate at least one Freezone group in the late 80s - is there anyone on the board who remembers that? I'm keen to hear from both sides! Are there many Freezone members left in NZ now, or has it mostly faded away? Does anyone ever join the Freezone without trying CoS scientology first?

I've also got some more general questions about the Freezone philosophy and practice - I understand it's different for every group and indeed every freezone scientologist, but how does it different from the modern-day CoS scientology? Do you/they declare people SPs, practice disconnection, believe in 'always attack, never defend' and Hubbard's theories on psychiatry and psychiatric medication? I'm really interested in how much the CoS and the Freezone groups have diverged both ideologically and practically.

I hope someone can answer my questions!

[Leon]

I'll answer a few of them as best I can.

I myself was involved in the CofS on staff in South Africa throughout the 1970s and early '80s. Most of that time in the Tech area.  I led what we at that time called the "breakaway movement" in Cape Town taking about 30 or 40 of the field with me. Someone else led them in Johanesburg and she set up an AAC (Advanced Ability Centre) under the direction of David Mayo. I liaised with them and after a few years moved to Joburg and delivered Scientology there for ten years, including the "upper levels". The I moved back to Cape Town and then, a few years later in 2001, to New Zealand.

I have been auditing and training guys here since then, sometimes fulltime, currently part time.

I know nothing of any freezone activity here prior to my arrival.  The only group I know of that broke away from the CofS in New Zealand was back in about 1971 when John Dalhoff broke away in CVhristchurch and set up Zenith Applied Philosophy (ZAP)and claimed that he was the true source of all of scientology and so on.  The remnants of that group are still around. I'm basically friends with them even though I'm not a member.

Internationally freezone groups deliver spiritual betterment in one form or another. Some are pretty hardcore LRH tech, others are developments thereof. There have been many developments, some very good ones too.

The practice of disconnection and heavy ethics and slavery was never regarded by any of us as being true to Scientology fundamentals and I know of no place in the freezone that ever tried to apply them. Scientology is properly the subject of individual spiritual growth - becoming a bigger being. What you see in the press about Scientology and in the discussion boards - in fact all the crap you read about it - is not genuine Scientology in the sense that it has nothing to do with spiritual growth. It is a load of aberrated policy and dogma that Hubbard cooked up to "run the Orgs" and manage the people - (read "enslave" the people.

real Scientology is very very different. It is an intelligent subject with very beneficial results.

At present, so far as I know, I am the only guy delivering Scio in the Freezone in New Zealand. I'm in Christchurch and anyone wishing to know more can pm me. I'm happy to meet with anyone.  Unfortunately (or fortunately) my experience if Scientology has on the whole been very very good. I have had them disconnect from me after I left but have no family in there so there was nothing that really cut me up.  Also things in South African Scientology never got as insane as they did in America.

Hope this helps,


Leon

[rockyslammer]

I can't say miss cabbage squirrelled the tech as soon as he took over.  He did start by  imposing his will over scientologists, individual, missions , groups, orgs etc.

He drove off anyone who he thought might have been a threat to him - like David Mayo and many more.  That always happens in your typical palace coup - and this was a textbook example.

I have first hand knowledge of the first freezone movement.  I was in at the beginning. No group that I knew of ever intended to do anything but use scientology for good - the "ethics" side of it was always very gentle if it existed at all.

scientology infiltrated David Mayo's AAC - I was there at the time and but he/she wasn't discovered until later.  The AAC Santa Barbara was the main target, as David was senior CS and hubbard's CS.

Many freezone groups morphed in to something else after the AAC went down.  I was getting mail for years after from one group that spun off from the AAC.  Metaphysical something or other.  My memory is not so good.

I was with a freezone group in Miami for a year.  Peter Lauritzen and class 8 Gwen North.  I have no idea what happened to them but they didn't seem to be infiltrated in any way.  Of course they were "burgled" during the Xmas holiday and their computer and all the member records taken!!!! - stolen.  One can only guess.

I personally also knew Capt. Bill but he was a bit way out for my taste.  Nice guy though.  Too many conspiracy theories for me.

I guess every group now does its own thing - there is no central administering body - a bit like anonymous!

That will mean there will be "hobby horses" out there and you just choose the group you want and which hobby horse suits you best.

I know some freezoners who really believe the OT3 data as given by hubbard.  That's their choice and as long as they don't harm people then maybe it's no more harmful that "Lord of the Rings"?  The fact that is provably untrue (OT3 that is - I KNOW LotR is totally true!) doesn't seem to matter to them.

There is no harm in sitting down with someone and talking and maybe some benefit.  At it's basic basic that is what scientology is.

regards
Martin

[AnonKiwi]

WTF, Lord of the Rings is untrue?! ;)

[anonyrat]

Hey Leon and Martin, thanks for answering my questions!  :)

It's great to hear firsthand from people who were involved. You all (ex-CoScientologists) bring knowledge and experience with CoS that is invaluable to the anonymous campaign.

I'm glad to have it confirmed that freezoners don't practice the more harmful parts of LRH scientology; I was fairly sure that was the case but good to know for sure! From a purely practical point of view, if you don't have a very hierarchical structure full of control freaks set up to control your worldwide organisation then you don't need to use things like heavy 'ethics,' knowledge reports, the RPF etc to keep your worker bees in line and producing.

I've heard of Zenith Applied Philosophy; I think an ex-sci mentioned that they came in for some harassment when they first set up. I heard from somewhere that there was an NZ group that split off in the late 80s that the CoS were spying on for a while, but I don't know their name.

[Jack Parsons]

The ZAP crowd are pretty nasty in their own right. They are most famous for two things:

1) getting involved in extreme-right politics - http://indymedia.org.nz/newswire/display/45086/index.php

2) making members who're in their equivalent of a "lower ethics condition" sell ZAP literature wearing nothing but their underwear in Cathedral Square.

Question for the Freezoners: I was interested in Freezone tech myself a few years ago, and came across a website called "freezone.org.nz". It had a pretty laid-back, breezy style, light on LRH jargon, and a discussion forum. It's not there now - know who used to run that?

[Libertas]

Hi, I'm hoping a Freezoner or ex-sci or three will be able to answer my questions.

I've heard that after Hubbard died and Davey Miscavige took over and started squirreling the tech and declaring lots of people SPs, some New Zealand Scientologists split off and formed their own freezone groups. Does anyone know how they were treated by the NZ CoS? I assume they tried to crack down pretty hard on them; was there much fair gaming and harrassment going on? Are there any people who personally experienced this willing to speak out publically or anonymously about that?

I've also heard that CoS members tried to infiltrate at least one Freezone group in the late 80s - is there anyone on the board who remembers that? I'm keen to hear from both sides! Are there many Freezone members left in NZ now, or has it mostly faded away? Does anyone ever join the Freezone without trying CoS scientology first?

I've also got some more general questions about the Freezone philosophy and practice - I understand it's different for every group and indeed every freezone scientologist, but how does it different from the modern-day CoS scientology? Do you/they declare people SPs, practice disconnection, believe in 'always attack, never defend' and Hubbard's theories on psychiatry and psychiatric medication? I'm really interested in how much the CoS and the Freezone groups have diverged both ideologically and practically.

I hope someone can answer my questions!

I know this was posted months ago but hey, better late than never.

There was a "squirrel" group in Auckland.  I can't remember what they called themselves.  I do know the names of some of the folk involved.  I prefer to not post their names on a public forum as they probably went through enough when they were infiltrated by the CofS.  The folk in the "squirrel" group were ex-scientologists as far as I know. 

Yes, the "squirrel" group in Auckland was infiltrated by the CofS.  This was done approx. 1990/91 although there may have been other attempts made earlier than this.

The infiltration was to find out about any copyright violations (of the trademarked works of scientology) by the "squirrel" group.

[AnonKiwi]

Interesting, how did it pan out in the end?